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Raw video and licenses

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ok sorry I am just getting into this higher end stuff...
but I want the best quality out of my equipment when I get it. So it looks like you have to pay another grand for that!? Can I still at least record video and watch a raw format without the licenses?
The inspire 1 pro can shoot and play raw video for free right? Why do we have to pay for it now?!
Raw in still cameras you don't have to pay for right!?
So see I am just not getting this?
If someone could even just point me in the right direction to learn about all this I would appreciate it!
So is there no why to shoot video at the highest level with out the liencses on this new inspire 2?
Thanks!
 
Can I still at least record video and watch a raw format without the licenses?
No.

The inspire 1 pro can shoot and play raw video for free right? Why do we have to pay for it now?!
Well,... no, the I1 Pro (with X5) can't shoot RAW, only the I1 RAW (with X5R) can.
The X5R can shoot RAW "for free", but it costs more than an X5S + RAW license, so... no, it's not actually "free".

Just a different way of doing things. One same camera with a license to get the high end features, instead of 2 different camera models priced with a similar difference.

The new system may make you feel like you're getting screwed, but it's actually more flexible. You can buy the camera now and do compressed video, then just pay the license later if you want to upgrade. If you wanted to do that with the I1 you'd have to completely replace the camera, and get rid of a 2nd hand X5 which would likely cost you significantly more.
 
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Hmm ok so the inspire 1 raw x5 camera actually has the license price built in? Is that what you are saying?

So would this be pretty much the same as with high end DSLR cameras when you buy the camera you are actually still paying for the license in one way or another?

So anytime a person records in "raw" they had to pay for it?

Now playing raw videos or looking at a raw pictures you can still do without a license right? For instantance if I was to share a video or photo I shot in raw with another person you could open it up and look/watch it?

Thanks again!
 
So RAW really isn't a distribution format, unlikely you would want to share a raw file with someone due to the massive file size and also unlikely that any media players would play it. Raw is really intended as a high quality acquisition format to get maximum flexibility in grading. So you really don't want to be messing with raw video unless you really need to. Raw photos are different but you'd still need something like photoshop to process them before viewing.
 
Hmm this just does not add up... from their own page it says cinemaDNG IS FREE! no license needed!? Found here: CinemaDNG » FAQ

So why again do I need to pay over Thousand for this again?
 
Hmm this just does not add up... from their own page it says cinemaDNG IS FREE! no license needed!? Found here: CinemaDNG » FAQ

So why again do I need to pay over Thousand for this again?

It's a 'license fee' to 'unlock' a feature payable to DJI. It's just the pricing structure that they decided to go with. Not a very uncommon one. Like apps on the app store that charge you more to unlock more 'features'. Same idea. I'd rather they price the camera at a reasonable price and let me pay for the upgrade when I need it. Rather than having to replace the whole camera to upgrade which would cost alot more
 
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ok sorry I am just getting into this higher end stuff...
but I want the best quality out of my equipment when I get it. So it looks like you have to pay another grand for that!? Can I still at least record video and watch a raw format without the licenses?
The inspire 1 pro can shoot and play raw video for free right? Why do we have to pay for it now?!
Raw in still cameras you don't have to pay for right!?
So see I am just not getting this?
If someone could even just point me in the right direction to learn about all this I would appreciate it!
So is there no why to shoot video at the highest level with out the liencses on this new inspire 2?
Thanks!
Simple answer no - you are paying for the licence to use the codec.
Very common on professional cameras or sometimes you will have an option to 'upgrade' and unlock 4k capability on a camera for which you pay a premium.
 
I want the higher end camera for photo quality, I can still shoot 4K video without the licences yes?


Sent from my iPhone using InspirePilots
 
So why again do I need to pay over Thousand for this again?
DJI have simply decided to make a single pretty affordable camera but charge extra for the advanced features, that's it.
I hate that way of working (artificially crippling a product you've paid for fully and actually has the capabilities) but it's their choice.

You can shoot 4K video of course, just not in RAW or ProRes.
 
Ok thanks everyone I guess it makes sense, but yes I feel the same way Kilrah. Paying for this essentially imaginary "license" to use a codec that is open source, free! Just hard to swallow!
But I guess at the same rate like aero said it's better to be able to "unlock" them instead of buying a whole new camera with them "activated". Now if you get another camera they should stay activated correct!

It just really sucks having a camera with all the capabilities but not be able to use them!
I guess that's just another way to get money! That's business....

Thanks again everyone!
 
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Ok thanks anyone I guess it makes sense, but yes I feel the same way Kilrah. Paying for this essentially imaginary "license" to use a codec that is open source, free! Just hard to swallow!
But I guess at the same rate like aero said it's better to be able to "unlock" them instead of buying a whole new camera with them "activated". Now if you get another camera they should stay activated correct!

It just really sucks having a camera with all the capabilities but not be able to use them!
I guess that's just another way to get money! That's business....

Thanks again everyone!
Correct, the licenses are unlocking the raw features in the aircraft and not in the camera as that's where the processing takes place now.
 
Will be interesting how it fairs for them. It other fields this practice is often very poorly received by the public because it's hard not to feel "scammed" when the product you bought has the hardware and software needed for a certain capability yet they want more to make them usable.
A price difference is much less accepted that way than when the low end and high end devices use different hardware, the more powerful one being obviously more expensive and the cost is reasonably passed on to you. Here you get the feel you're paying for the top end hardware (that they can reasonably sell at the price you paid, proving it's not that expensive) but not getting the right to use it, and the extra is jsut "greed".

In electronics it's common with oscilloscopes, with license unlocks for some features like higher bandwidth or bigger memory depth. They sell you hardware that is obviously capable of the highest performance level, but that is only used to a fraction of its capabilites by default, and you need to nearly double the price to unlock it. The memory is there, the fast ADCs are there, but only sleeping until you pay. Even worse in that case since it is obvious and widely known that the full capabilities require 0 additional software or other work for the company to make use of... So you know you can have great HW for the $X they sell it to you for, and any extra they ask you to use it fully is pure bonus for them... it actually costs them to implement the limitations! Hard not to feel ripped off, and this regularly sparks endless heated discussions becasue it's obviously more complicated than that, and it kinda "sponsors" the entry level (think product always costs $2000, but instead of making everyone pay $2000 they can sell the entry level version for $1500 becasue they compensate by making people pay $2500 when they want the advanced features) but that doesn't change the feeling you get, and the fact that those who want/need the advanced features are typically losing to favor the cheapskates...
 
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Ok thanks anyone I guess it makes sense, but yes I feel the same way Kilrah. Paying for this essentially imaginary "license" to use a codec that is open source, free! Just hard to swallow!
But I guess at the same rate like aero said it's better to be able to "unlock" them instead of buying a whole new camera with them "activated". Now if you get another camera they should stay activated correct!

It just really sucks having a camera with all the capabilities but not be able to use them!
I guess that's just another way to get money! That's business....

Thanks again everyone!

I hope my clients do not perceive my photo license as "imaginary" being as how it is a clear and stated contract to use the work I have created.

DJI is doing it this way and you don't seem to even know what RAW video is so why are you so concerned with it, it is a very high end and professional workflow that most people do not need.
 
Ok thanks everyone I guess it makes sense, but yes I feel the same way Kilrah. Paying for this essentially imaginary "license" to use a codec that is open source, free! Just hard to swallow!
But I guess at the same rate like aero said it's better to be able to "unlock" them instead of buying a whole new camera with them "activated". Now if you get another camera they should stay activated correct!

It just really sucks having a camera with all the capabilities but not be able to use them!
I guess that's just another way to get money! That's business....

Thanks again everyone!
Just checked with dji and no transfer of licenses:
The licenses will be binding to the drone's SN number.
 
Michael your photo license is your work, that makes more sense!
DNG is free!!!! Why do I have to pay for it!!
I know what RAW (not everything hence my questions) is that's why I was shocked about this whole license! Never stop to think about all that... made me re-think what I knew! plus I am thinking about getting into video/pictures more, so ya have much to learn! Was like did something change from long ago to where you now have to pay for every little thing! Come on! Is it Not enough for me to buy and handover my money to get something that can shoot the quality I want, but then be told oh wait if you actually want to get the best out of it you need to give me some more money for this, yes "imaginary license" why I'm I exactly giving you this money? Don't I already have everything I need? Isn't DNG a free open source codec? Do you see were I am coming from? I would like to here the response to this? Could they even answer it themselves? Other than well.... it's just another way to bring down the price to make it look not as expensive! What a joke!
Michael it would be the same as me buying a photo that you produced for me and telling me I can't look at it unless you pay me, let's say a license fee to look! But I already paid you I have the photo right here, I have everything I need right here! Sorry "it's a license fee" I know this is a bit awkward to see it this way, but it is different than paying you for the normal photo license so that I can make copies of a photo your took etc... I understand that... that's "your work" that's what I'm paying you for, but had to put it in another way to fit the sitsuation...
But then again I guess it's DGI's platform we are paying for?! But again using others peoples format to make money off of!? Do you see!! It's not their work! But again their platform I suppose... just all seems shady... doesn't sit well with me is all.. Kilrah wrote it well above it is just a shame!

it's sad when a group of people make an open source piece of software/codec to make it, well "open" and for then others (corporations) to make money off of it!? Is that even legal lol!
From the looks of it we can capture raw photos right!? But not video? Just don't make sense! Oh but wait DNG burst we need to pay for? This pricing schematic is a scam! This is why I had to start asking questions! Can I even look at these "highly classified RAW formats anymore" is this a new type of format that I don't know of... why all these licenses!!

But like said above it's just a money maker I see, a way to get every penny they can from their "system". I guess that's how they get around not being sued for charging us to use a FREE codec!
See this is why I was shocked I have used RAW photos long ago and never heard of being charged to take photos!? I have viewed them in the past...
And that's again why I was taken back by this huge license fee and yes "imaginary" that's for sure!!

Ok off my rant lol... and I am sure you all have been in this business longer than me... and this is the norm... and I just need to be brought up to speed on all this high-end recording mojo... but from Kilrah comments I see I am not alone!
I appreciate again everyone's comments!
 
Michael your photo license is your work, that makes more sense!
DNG is free!!!! Why do I have to pay for it!!
I know what RAW (not everything hence my questions) is that's why I was shocked about this whole license! Never stop to think about all that... made me re-think what I knew! plus I am thinking about getting into video/pictures more, so ya have much to learn! Was like did something change from long ago to where you now have to pay for every little thing! Come on! Is it Not enough for me to buy and handover my money to get something that can shoot the quality I want, but then be told oh wait if you actually want to get the best out of it you need to give me some more money for this, yes "imaginary license" why I'm I exactly giving you this money? Don't I already have everything I need? Isn't DNG a free open source codec? Do you see were I am coming from? I would like to here the response to this? Could they even answer it themselves? Other than well.... it's just another way to bring down the price to make it look not as expensive! What a joke!
Michael it would be the same as me buying a photo that you produced for me and telling me I can't look at it unless you pay me, let's say a license fee to look! But I already paid you I have the photo right here, I have everything I need right here! Sorry "it's a license fee" I know this is a bit awkward to see it this way, but it is different than paying you for the normal photo license so that I can make copies of a photo your took etc... I understand that... that's "your work" that's what I'm paying you for, but had to put it in another way to fit the sitsuation...
But then again I guess it's DGI's platform we are paying for?! But again using others peoples format to make money off of!? Do you see!! It's not their work! But again their platform I suppose... just all seems shady... doesn't sit well with me is all.. Kilrah wrote it well above it is just a shame!

it's sad when a group of people make an open source piece of software/codec to make it, well "open" and for then others (corporations) to make money off of it!? Is that even legal lol!
From the looks of it we can capture raw photos right!? But not video? Just don't make sense! Oh but wait DNG burst we need to pay for? This pricing schematic is a scam! This is why I had to start asking questions! Can I even look at these "highly classified RAW formats anymore" is this a new type of format that I don't know of... why all these licenses!!

But like said above it's just a money maker I see, a way to get every penny they can from their "system". I guess that's how they get around not being sued for charging us to use a FREE codec!
See this is why I was shocked I have used RAW photos long ago and never heard of being charged to take photos!? I have viewed them in the past...
And that's again why I was taken back by this huge license fee and yes "imaginary" that's for sure!!

Ok off my rant lol... and I am sure you all have been in this business longer than me... and this is the norm... and I just need to be brought up to speed on all this high-end recording mojo... but from Kilrah comments I see I am not alone!
I appreciate again everyone's comments!

I think you're confusing raw photos with the cinemaDNG raw videos here. The additional license only applies to CinemaDNG videos which from the sound of it you will probably not use anyway. I do work commercially and so far haven't come across any clients who would want to use CinemaDNG raw videos anyway. Unless you're on a very high quality production i.e. hollywood, its probably not worth going raw because of the huge amount of additional processing power/space required. There are not many cameras out there at this price point that captures in CinemaDNG raw anyway. Most of them that do are way more expensive than the X5S plus license fee.

Also I think your comparison to licensing photos is a little flawed. In incorporating CinemaDNG raw into the product, I'm sure the DJI engineers would have to spend some effort to incorporate them into the product. How hard was it to incorporate into the product, that I don't know. It would be fair to say they should expect some return on that investment. Not saying the pricing structure is the best but thats what they went for. I don't see it as free loading on the open-source codec. The camera just prevents you from recording in CinemaDNG raw. Once recorded there's nothing stopping you from viewing them.
 
Aerobrace,
That's about how I am looking at it from this point. You are right they had to build the platform, so I am giving them that! I guess I just need to start looking at it from that perspective. And I actually would like to use the raw/cinemaDNG to achieve the best possible results and editing power, whether just for my own personal videos, messing around as a hobby, or if I might venture out more on a professional manner... I don't think you always have to work for Hollywood to use this stuff... If you are going to film something, why not always shoot for the best!
But yes looking at this way I think will make giving up my money a bit easier lol

Oh and I guess I looked at it wrong that the burst DNG stills needed a license. They just need the DJI cinessd which I though looked originally to only be utilized by prores and CinemaDNG... but I guess you can use it to store your stills on? I think I also read they are also allowing the H264/5 to also be stored on it as well? So I guess their workflow chart is not totally correct?
Is is correct?
 
it's sad when a group of people make an open source piece of software/codec to make it, well "open" and for then others (corporations) to make money off of it!? Is that even legal lol! from the looks of it we can capture raw photos right!? But not video? Just don't make sense! Oh but wait DNG burst we need to pay for? This pricing schematic is a scam! This is why I had to start asking questions! Can I even look at these "highly classified RAW formats anymore" is this a new type of format that I don't know of... why all these licenses!!

But like said above it's just a money maker I see, a way to get every penny they can from their "system". I guess that's how they get around not being sued for charging us to use a FREE codec! See this is why I was shocked I have used RAW photos long ago and never heard of being charged to take photos!? I have viewed them in the past... And that's again why I was taken back by this huge license fee and yes "imaginary" that's for sure!!

It's not a pricing scam. Think of it as downloading a demo of an application and in order to save your files you need to buy a license for it. Same thing here. When you buy an Arri Alexa/Ameria/Mini/65, A Sony F55 or a Red camera you have to buy licenses to unlock features. If you want High-speed that's a license, you want PRORES XT, that's a license you want HDR (on the Sony and Red) that's a license. Same camera, same firmware. You have to pay for the option to use it. There are times that you need to sub-rent a camera body and then have to get a rental license that expires in order to get you through the shoot with out fully unlocking the camera. Not a scam, not imaginary, It's a business choice to build the camera at a more attractive price for the consumers and the that need it stump the fees and honestly don't care, its part of the cost of doing business and really $1500 is 1/2day on the gear rental. Heres another part of the X5r that shines. While recording the ProRes files to the SSD your H.265 proxy file is being recorded to SD card so that you can view it right there on the spot and check the images or you can upload that proxy file and your editor can grab it and use those proxy's as a place holder for the raw or ProRes files that are delivered a little later

But this shows a bigger problem. Hobbyist buying a Drone/Camera combo that is targeted at Cine and TV pro's. the I2's design and workflow is optimized to be used on a TV show or feature film. H.264/265 recording to SD card is sufficient for the hobbyist. ProRes on the other hand is a end to end workflow optimized format. Acquisition, Edit, Color Timing and then distribution or linking a RAW File applying the color correction and edit XML then rendering out to the deliverable format. The Pros understand and accept this.
 
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