The Evolution of "Commercial" Status

[billtrevaskis]

Hypothetically, do users on this forum think that, in the near future, the FAA will develop its consumer/commercial UAV laws such that a pilots license will not be required for a single user to fly?

Maybe I'm a bit naive about the whole thing, but it seems a bit out of proportion to require "commercial" users to hold a manned aircraft license when flying something like the Inspire. Would it be comparable to requiring a tractor-trailer license to drive a Honda civic?

Thanks for your input, everyone.

 

[kcobello]

Agreed. I do respect the pilots and the knowledge and safety required. My thought is also we generally fly in a "box" with our AP. We're not transporting people, much weight, and are generally hovering.

 

[Mazz]

It's all part of the upcoming plan. They will eventually only require the ground school and a bit of specialty training plus some registration and a background check. It's all coming.

 

[Meta4]

Hypothetically, do users on this forum think that, in the near future, the FAA will develop its consumer/commercial UAV laws such that a pilots license will not be required for a single user to fly?
Maybe I'm a bit naive about the whole thing, but it seems a bit out of proportion to require "commercial" users to hold a manned aircraft license when flying something like the Inspire.
Would it be comparable to requiring a tractor-trailer license to drive a Honda civic?

It's more like requiring a medical degree to apply a bandaid and completely ridiculous.
The skills and training to fly a real plane have very little to do with successfully piloting a multirotor.
When flying and photographing recreationally is completely legal, the FAA and other countries aviation safety bodies have it all ***-backwards requiring a pilot's licence for commercial photography with a multirotor.

The FAA is quite aware of this and at their usual glacially slow pace are working toward doing something about it - eventually.
Here's an overview of what they have been considering for almost a year already. https://www.faa.gov/regulations_policies/rulemaking/media/021515_sUAS_Summary.pdf
Or the full document: https://www.faa.gov/regulations_pol.../2120-AJ60_NPRM_2-15-2015_joint_signature.pdf

 

[billtrevaskis]

It's more like requiring a medical degree to apply a bandaid and completely ridiculous.
The skills and training to fly a real plane have very little to do with successfully piloting a multirotor.
When flying and photographing recreationally is completely legal, the FAA and other countries aviation safety bodies have it all ***-backwards requiring a pilot's licence for commercial photography with a multirotor.

The FAA is quite aware of this and at their usual glacially slow pace are working toward doing something about it - eventually.
Here's an overview of what they have been considering for almost a year already. https://www.faa.gov/regulations_policies/rulemaking/media/021515_sUAS_Summary.pdf
Or the full document: https://www.faa.gov/regulations_pol.../2120-AJ60_NPRM_2-15-2015_joint_signature.pdf

Thanks for sharing this! I wonder what this aeronautical knowledge test might entail...

 

[Mazz]

Thanks for sharing this! I wonder what this aeronautical knowledge test might entail...

I took this test this year. I can tell you exactly what's on it but better yet, you can try it with real questions from the test. My directions from my instructor was take this test over and over until you get 90 or above which is what I did. Try it out.
www.Exams4pilots.org

 

[licensed pilot]

It's more like requiring a medical degree to apply a bandaid and completely ridiculous.
The skills and training to fly a real plane have very little to do with successfully piloting a multirotor.
When flying and photographing recreationally is completely legal, the FAA and other countries aviation safety bodies have it all ***-backwards requiring a pilot's licence for commercial photography with a multirotor.

The FAA is quite aware of this and at their usual glacially slow pace are working toward doing something about it - eventually.
Here's an overview of what they have been considering for almost a year already. https://www.faa.gov/regulations_policies/rulemaking/media/021515_sUAS_Summary.pdf
Or the full document: https://www.faa.gov/regulations_pol.../2120-AJ60_NPRM_2-15-2015_joint_signature.pdf

An operator certificate is coming in a year or two (just a written test). The process has been slow but I 'm not an FAA apologist. They were caught by surprised with the whole UAV technology explosion. And you are missing the point. The FAA is well aware the skills involved are different. However, there is an aeronautical body of knowledge anyone operating in the national airspace must be familiar with to operate safely, beginning with FARs (federal aviation regulations) . Take an online ground school and you'll see you didn't know what you didn't know. No offense but commercial UAV flying is a professional activity with the necessary regulations to keep it professional.

I totally agree with the temporary certificated pilot requirement for commercial operators for purely safety reasons. I recently had a face-to-face with a quad flyer about why I needed to meet 333 requirements and I was appalled at his ignorance of basic aeronautical knowledge. He was a classic example of the "you don't know what you don't know" axiom. And yes, I have an FAA pilot certificate (commercial). Have patience, the new FAA sUAS operator certificate is coming...

 

[billtrevaskis]

An operator certificate is coming in a year or two (just a written test). The process has been slow but I 'm not an FAA apologist. They were caught by surprised with the whole UAV technology explosion. And you are missing the point. The FAA is well aware the skills involved are different. However, there is an aeronautical body of knowledge anyone operating in the national airspace must be familiar with to operate safely, beginning with FARs (federal aviation regulations) . Take an online ground school and you'll see you didn't know what you didn't know. No offense but commercial UAV flying is a professional activity with the necessary regulations to keep it professional.

I totally agree with the temporary certificated pilot requirement for commercial operators for purely safety reasons. I recently had a face-to-face with a quad flyer about why I needed to meet 333 requirements and I was appalled at his ignorance of basic aeronautical knowledge. He was a classic example of the "you don't know what you don't know" axiom. And yes, I have an FAA pilot certificate (commercial). Have patience, the new FAA sUAS operator certificate is coming...

I totally agree. It's like anything, really: accountability and responsibility must be maintained when commercial use of the airspace is being utilized. I'm thankful that many people on here are knowledgeable enough to respect that and also thankful for all of you with some knowledge of what is to come. That is really what I was looking for. Much appreciated.

 

[InspiredOne]

I took this test this year. I can tell you exactly what's on it but better yet, you can try it with real questions from the test. My directions from my instructor was take this test over and over until you get 90 or above which is what I did. Try it out.
www.Exams4pilots.org

Sounds like Common Core.

 

[Bruce Bowsher]

I have yet to see where they are requiring that....?

 

[Jimmykjimmy]

An operator certificate is coming in a year or two (just a written test). The process has been slow but I 'm not an FAA apologist. They were caught by surprised with the whole UAV technology explosion. And you are missing the point. The FAA is well aware the skills involved are different. However, there is an aeronautical body of knowledge anyone operating in the national airspace must be familiar with to operate safely, beginning with FARs (federal aviation regulations) . Take an online ground school and you'll see you didn't know what you didn't know. No offense but commercial UAV flying is a professional activity with the necessary regulations to keep it professional.

I totally agree with the temporary certificated pilot requirement for commercial operators for purely safety reasons. I recently had a face-to-face with a quad flyer about why I needed to meet 333 requirements and I was appalled at his ignorance of basic aeronautical knowledge. He was a classic example of the "you don't know what you don't know" axiom. And yes, I have an FAA pilot certificate (commercial). Have patience, the new FAA sUAS operator certificate is coming...

I understand the need for accountability, but who is going to enforce this, not the local police. I also subscribe to the phantom 3 forum and since Xmas the chatter has increased substantially, and so has the number of crashes people are reporting. Not too many $1200 crashes and the noise will go away, as will the bozos flying. And you need to have a purpose for flying, just over your house is going to get boring.
I believe that the FAA will develop some simple test for guys that want to fly commercially. The test will relate to flying a quad. And if you injure someone, as with any business you need to have liability insurance.
Having a pilots license is overkill. When DJI finishes the beta on 1.7 for the quad you will need to provide your flight log when your in a restricted area. Of course, that will be burdensome also, but that's the only way your going to regulate flying a quad...passive registration control...of course with thousands of flights weekly the administration is going to get tricky.

 

[licensed pilot]

I have yet to see where they are requiring that....?

Requiring what? There's no operator certification required for hobby flying, but if you want to fly commercially you must have an FAA pilot certificate, at least sport license. That is spelled out in the 333 document one an exemption is granted.

 

[james tulloch]

I wouldnt mind sitting any flight training,would like to get one for flying the I1 am no daft when I am flying, an okay most of the rules,altitude I go over as up in shetland we don't see many aircraft except the odd helicopter but for me to go south to a training centre and get a license would cost in the region of £3500,you need to sell a lot of pictures to cover that

 

[kcobello]

I think we should be tested and understand what it takes to put an object in the airspace. Until the UAV certification is in place we will be required to follow what is in place, the pilot license. I understand the reasoning.

 

[licensed pilot]

FYI. I attended an FAA briefing yesterday in Chandler, AZ. The FAA presenter(from the UAS integration office) was very confident that the Part 107 commercial operations rules (no manned aircraft pilot license required, written exam for UAS certificate) will likely come on June 2016. I know it's the government and deadlines have come and gone, but for what is worth; there may be light at the end of this tunnel.

 

[billtrevaskis]

FYI. I attended an FAA briefing yesterday in Chandler, AZ. The FAA presenter(from the UAS integration office) was very confident that the Part 107 commercial operations rules (no manned aircraft pilot license required, written exam for UAS certificate) will likely come on June 2016. I know it's the government and deadlines have come and gone, but for what is worth; there may be light at the end of this tunnel.

This could be good news! I'd be happy to take a course or two and/or test to make this work better for those of us not actually flying passenger/private aircraft.

 

[Plumcrazy]

TheFAA is tasked with regulating the national airspace(NAS). Commercial air travel is the safest form oftransportation in the USA, mainly because of the safety rules & regs implemented by the FAA. No small feat! With the explosion of uav use in such a short time, the safety of flight operations had to start somewhere.

Requiring a pilots certificate has nothing to do with the operations of a uav, is has to do with the knowledge of the airspace environment. It's far more complex then, say, the regulations to drive a car. There's several different classes of airspace, weather and environmental issues, altitude restrictions, glide paths and moa's (military operation areas), notams (notice to airman), just to name a few.

The current commercial regs are sec. 333 exemptions! Thinkabout this! Exemptions?? From what?? Funny you shouldask! Currently, the FAA requires you to register yourcommercial uav with an 'N' number. This is the 'license tag' for all aircraft or registered in the US. When that's done, auav is coming in the same category as Cessna, Learjet, or Boeing 747. The 'exemptions' you file for are so you don't have to meet certain mandatory requirements. Some areequipment related, like radios and transponders. Some are airspace, 500' agl (above ground level) is pretty much a hardlimit everywhere, unless you're a crop duster or news helicopter with a proper notam filed. And then!!! You canapply for a COA (certificate of authorization) which givesyou the clearance to actually fly. The FAA was being prettygenerous in granting a blanket COA up to 200' agl to all whofiled for the exemption! Anything higher, file for a new COA.

 

[Plumcrazy]

Anyway, could go on and on. Let's give them some credit, its safer to fly commercially then it is walk across the street!!

That being said, it's still a huge gub'ment agency that's not very able when it comes to changing fast. When the rules finally come out (they say June 2016, don't hold your breath (see above)), there will probably be a shiny new rating for a commercial uav pilot! Expect to get schooled on the things I mentioned, as well as some profiency requirements that you may have to meet. There will be a test (or 2). The FAA can and has been flexible. Used to be, private, commercial, and ATP (airline transport pilot) were the only ratings. Now there's also sport and recreational ratings, which require less training and experience. Prove a need, and the FAA will respond (just not very fast).

Ok! My rants over. ✈ fly safe!

 

[Jimmykjimmy]

Anyway, could go on and on. Let's give them some credit, its safer to fly commercially then it is walk across the street!!

That being said, it's still a huge gub'ment agency that's not very able when it comes to changing fast. When the rules finally come out (they say June 2016, don't hold your breath (see above)), there will probably be a shiny new rating for a commercial uav pilot! Expect to get schooled on the things I mentioned, as well as some profiency requirements that you may have to meet. There will be a test (or 2). The FAA can and has been flexible. Used to be, private, commercial, and ATP (airline transport pilot) were the only ratings. Now there's also sport and recreational ratings, which require less training and experience. Prove a need, and the FAA will respond (just not very fast).

Ok! My rants over. ✈ fly safe!

Thank God your rant is over. Diatribes get pretty boring.

 

[Plumcrazy]

Gee.... didn't think I was angry or bitter...