The loss of capacity/runtime cannot be avoided. You can only slow the degradation process down by using proper LiPo charge/discharge/use practices.
Battery life 93% after 28 cycles ?
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The loss of capacity/runtime cannot be avoided. You can only slow the degradation process down by using proper LiPo charge/discharge/use practices.
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This again shows a total lack of understanding of battery chemistry and how all cells will decrease in capacity with age.
To say you "do not expect product capacity decrease over its lifetime" demonstrates you have no comprehension on how packs age or how they perform over time.
I would suggest you stick to things you might know something about as it certainly isn't multirotors, lipo packs or radio control anything!
Why do you persist in sprouting this utter rubbish all over the forum when you clearly have shown on numerous occasions you do not know what you are talking about?
Rather than an attitude like "I do not expect the capacity to decrease during the life of the product" which shows your lack of understanding of lipos, why not ask something like " Is it normal for lipos to decrease in capacity during their lifetime"
At least then you will get answers to you question and you may actually learn something about lithium polymer chemistry, characteristics, internal resistance and aging process.
Ok you again did not understand anything what I have written about.
I am not interested in chemistry, I dont have to be and the only knowledge important for this product is the information DJI gives about it when selling it and not any private opinion if this is true or not. I also dont care how they achieve this and if their cells made from kryptonite.
I did not speak about physics or chemistry I speak about my expectation that I do not expect product capacity decrease over a lifetime of a TB47 or TB48 DJI battery as a conclusion of all information provided by DJI upon purchase which is the only thing important for warranty.
This is a simple conclusion out of the information DJI gives
a) in Inspire manual
b) in battery safety guide
c) specs available on purchase on the item
Regarding CAPACITY DJI gives only ONE statement without any restriction:
The DJI Intelligent Flight Battery has a capacity of 4500mAh, voltage of 22.2V, and smart chargedischarge functionality.
Regarding BATTERY LIFE DJI explains exactly this:
Battery life: The battery life indicates how many more times the battery can be discharged and recharged before it must be replaced. When battery life reaches 0%, it can no longer be used.
Regarding maintenance DJI says:
Maintaining a Healthy Battery Life: Never over-discharge, as this may lead to battery cell damage. (they mention 18V as lowest voltage allowed somewhere else) Never use the battery when the temperature is too high or too low. Never store the battery in environments with a temperature higher than 60℃. Battery life may be reduced if not used for a long time.
So we have some important information here:
The battery is actually meant to be used until a battery life of 0%. Seriousely telling me this I expect of course not a capacity decrease with this as there is no single word about it. I also can not expect this means yes you can fly until 0% battery life but you just will be able to go 30sec up and 30sec down until the battery is exhausted.
The statements in the DJI manuals clearly indicate that Battery has a capacity of 4500mAh POINT. The battery life indicates how many more times the battery can be discharged and recharged before it must be replaced. POINT. When battery life reaches 0%, it can no longer be used. POINT.
How the hell I should expect or accept a decrease in capacity given this information?
There is absolutely no need for me to think about chemistry because I dont produce and sell this battery its their problem not mine and one of my rules is never make the problems of others to my problems.
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Ok you again did not understand anything what I have written about.
I am not interested in chemistry, I dont have to be and the only knowledge important for this product is the information DJI gives about it when selling it and not any private opinion if this is true or not. I also dont care how they achieve this and if their cells made from kryptonite.
I did not speak about physics or chemistry I speak about my expectation that I do not expect product capacity decrease over a lifetime of a TB47 or TB48 DJI battery as a conclusion of all information provided by DJI upon purchase which is the only thing important for warranty.
This is a simple conclusion out of the information DJI gives
a) in Inspire manual
b) in battery safety guide
c) specs available on purchase on the item
Regarding CAPACITY DJI gives only ONE statement without any restriction:
The DJI Intelligent Flight Battery has a capacity of 4500mAh, voltage of 22.2V, and smart chargedischarge functionality.
Regarding BATTERY LIFE DJI explains exactly this:
Battery life: The battery life indicates how many more times the battery can be discharged and recharged before it must be replaced. When battery life reaches 0%, it can no longer be used.
Regarding maintenance DJI says:
Maintaining a Healthy Battery Life: Never over-discharge, as this may lead to battery cell damage. (they mention 18V as lowest voltage allowed somewhere else) Never use the battery when the temperature is too high or too low. Never store the battery in environments with a temperature higher than 60℃. Battery life may be reduced if not used for a long time.
So we have some important information here:
The battery is actually meant to be used until a battery life of 0%. Seriousely telling me this I expect of course not a capacity decrease with this as there is no single word about it. I also can not expect this means yes you can fly until 0% battery life but you just will be able to go 30sec up and 30sec down until the battery is exhausted.
The statements in the DJI manuals clearly indicate that Battery has a capacity of 4500mAh POINT. The battery life indicates how many more times the battery can be discharged and recharged before it must be replaced. POINT. When battery life reaches 0%, it can no longer be used. POINT.
How the hell I should expect or accept a decrease in capacity given this information?
There is absolutely no need for me to think about chemistry because I dont produce and sell this battery its their problem not mine and one of my rules is never make the problems of others to my problems.
You really are the bane of my bloody life on these forums!
Its a tough enough job moderating this community and takes up enough of mine and Mazz's time which we give freely without individuals like you who come along and out of sheer arrogance (or ignorance - I'm not sure which) propagate both erroneous, factually wrong, pointless and bad advice.
You seem far more eaten up by the fact that because DJI doesn't state that your batteries will degrade over time they owe you a new one every six months.
You are living on planet ga-ga if you believe that! The only thing that is truly remarkable is your unfoundering belief that you are never wrong!
Please do not waste anyone else's time on these forums writing diatribes like the one above as I will not put anyone else through the boredom of reading your one man crusade against DJI and the wonderful European empire ! - I will just delete them!
If anyone genuinely believes that Macohman is serving any useful purpose on these forums please let me know. - If not I shall put everyone out of their misery!
No. Its of course not that easy.
But you must see the whole picture. Its not only what they dont say its also what they say and how they explain battery life.
The question is how much degradation has to be accepted and when can a faulty battery be assumed under the information given by DJI?
As an expert for LIPOs and their chemical reactions can you tell me please as DJI says the battery can still be used with 1% lifetime how much degredation is supposed to apply at 300 cycles?
Or how much degredation you would expect / accept (not necesarrily the same) at 100 cycles after 6 months?
Electric cars were discoverd to have 17% battery degrade over 3 years and battery degrade detected in warranty period is a warranty case however manufacurers now give extended guarantees like 100.000 km themselves.
Also there is a important difference between guarantee and warranty:
DJI can refuse their free guarantee for parts like batteries - but the dealer you bought it from under EU consumer law cannot refuse warranty (few exceptions apply like if a dealer in china does NOT target your country but you still manage to order there then chinese law would apply)
One reason DJI likes to accept your repair claim is because many things which would fall under your warranty with your dealer are not necessarily covered by free DJI guarantee. If you send things directly to DJI you waive your warranty right and apply for free DJI guarantee instead. One of the downsides using DJI guarantee instead of dealer warranty is that if parts are changed there is NO new 6(24) months warranty for the changes parts then. Obviousely I would never send a faulty battery directly to DJI for repair/exchange.
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I would simply do my own tests that are in my BNUCs operations manual, this way you will know exactly what your batteries are delivering
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Thanks Joe,
I updated the spreadsheet with your info except the capacity and "months in use",
please anyone it only takes a few minutes to write down your info there, I tried now the link bellow and it can be updated even without login in. I'm really curios to see batteries capacity after way more cycles than mine
Inspire 1 Lipo Statistics - Google Sheets
Thanks
Operating an Inspire 1 is a real challenge if you must keep SOP, Logs and such for professional reasons!
I love to fly this bird but the constant, often pointless (marketing/social media) upgrades are distracting me.
Over the past year the DJI battery lore has been amazing, very confusing and deeply contradictory as the thread above illustrates.
I understand LiPos but the Intelligent layer DJI has added leaves me feeling totally stupid. And yes... I can and do use a soldering iron on electronic projects. LiPos are a consumable just like gas, I get it. Mileage may vary... A LOT.
DJI has not updated their manuals, yet both the software and firmware are dramatically different from published.
Is there a definitive method for battery calibration as of March 2016 (+FW 1.7...)? (i know that is camera and AC is still 1.6...)
Previously I operated with DJI's instruction to let the aircraft turn itself off and then charge to full from there.
DJI-Tim (Dec 2015) reports OK to calibrate at 8%
Lynn Phan agrees if using old firmware:
Yet L.P. emphatically says: If you are running the latest battery FW 3.7... DO NOT bring your battery to 0% for conditioning. Zero in lipo terms or DJI terms?
OK so what is the best practice for cycling?
10 cycles or 20 or depending on season (hot/cold)?
Draw the battery down till the aircraft turns off (easy!) or watch for 8% display (boring and time wasting)?
Voltage 3.3 to calibrate? (DJI ~0%)
Voltage 3.8 to store? (DJI ~51%)
I love to fly this bird but the constant, often pointless (marketing/social media) upgrades are distracting me.
Over the past year the DJI battery lore has been amazing, very confusing and deeply contradictory as the thread above illustrates.
I understand LiPos but the Intelligent layer DJI has added leaves me feeling totally stupid. And yes... I can and do use a soldering iron on electronic projects. LiPos are a consumable just like gas, I get it. Mileage may vary... A LOT.
DJI has not updated their manuals, yet both the software and firmware are dramatically different from published.
Set Home Point icon is no longer on iOS main flight screen as described in current manual (for example).
Is there a definitive method for battery calibration as of March 2016 (+FW 1.7...)? (i know that is camera and AC is still 1.6...)
Previously I operated with DJI's instruction to let the aircraft turn itself off and then charge to full from there.
DJI-Tim (Dec 2015) reports OK to calibrate at 8%
Lynn Phan agrees if using old firmware:
Yet L.P. emphatically says: If you are running the latest battery FW 3.7... DO NOT bring your battery to 0% for conditioning. Zero in lipo terms or DJI terms?
OK so what is the best practice for cycling?
10 cycles or 20 or depending on season (hot/cold)?
Draw the battery down till the aircraft turns off (easy!) or watch for 8% display (boring and time wasting)?
Voltage 3.3 to calibrate? (DJI ~0%)
Voltage 3.8 to store? (DJI ~51%)
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Just watch your app and check battery.You will see the message to drain your battery 'till 5%.
What I'm doing is get your Inspire close to you and 2 ft above the ground.At certain point your app is asking you to return.Ignore and keep the Inspire at same level.At 10% your Inspire will go down,but keep the speed up and let your Inspire hoover.You need to work for this as your Inspire wants to go down.Once at 5% land and your ok..Charge battery and you will see that the message is gone.Good luck
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