Curious video results when panning

[crystalfat]

Hi everyone,
Ok!...at the end of my rope and all that!

Ever since the latest updates i've got major issues with the X5 now. Rotating the drone for a pan simply doesn't work with very odd video results. Any help greatly appreciated but the camera settings seem sound.
Manual
Iso 100
shutter 50
fps 24
wb auto
f 5.6
see an example of this type of juddering when panning here

password=inspire

best
chris

 

[niki]

Did the raw footage have the same playback issue?
When I have to shoot at 24fps I'm setting the exposure to 1/240 and so far didn't had any problems on slow moving shots.

 

[crystalfat]

yep the .mov had the exact same issue. I actually think the camera may not be functioning correctly.
I have tried different cards, all fast enough and previously working, been through all the variable camera settings yet nothing produces anything but this stuttering issue.

 

[The_Learning_Curve]

From my experience, panning with x3 or x5 is tough, it HAS to be very slow, especially when theres alot of detail. Only way around it is recording at 60 fps with high shutter speed.

 

[crystalfat]

Theoretically, panning at 30 fps with a shutter speed of 60 shouldn't be an issue. And indeed it never was. This is actually a fast pan compared to the previous attempts. And the issue was still there. For a camera of the supposed quality of the X5 and it's spec this should not be an issue. I have even done music videos successfully in low light with slow pans and the X5 previously. I'll contact DJI and see what they recommend. At the moment i simply cannot pan at all.

 

[The_Learning_Curve]

I dont think i ever had good results at 24 fps doing pans. Your video looks alot like mine when im at 24 fps. Maybe DJI can shed some light. Keep us updated!

 

[crystalfat]

Willdo.

 

[Blacksails]

I always thought this was panning too fast in 24fps. I have exactly the same issue on all but extremely slow pans when filming with the X5R in 24fps. I've seen this on both of the 2 X5R's I have owned. It's way less apparent in lower light for me and also, as mentioned, in low contrast low detail shots.
Adhering to the 180 rule brings the pleasant motion blur, but if the pan is too fast it still judders like mad.

 

[Jimmykjimmy]

When panning it's not uncommon to get the stuttering effect your referring too. It's pretty common with all cameras including DSLR's.
I'd recommend going to either 60fps or 29.95. This should reduce the amount of stuttering your seeing.

 

[Raymondo]

Welcome to the world of cinema. Those pans look about the same as would happen with any cinema film camera, which shoot at 24fps. Slow pans are the order of the day. Faster shutter speeds can make the problem worse. Stick with the old video rule of double the frame rate. Use nd filters if too bright for 1/50 or 1/60 shutter speed. And keep those pans slow if your project needs to be 24fps. If used online, you can up the frame rate and shutter speeds.

 

[filmflier]

Hi everyone,
Ok!...at the end of my rope and all that!

Ever since the latest updates i've got major issues with the X5 now. Rotating the drone for a pan simply doesn't work with very odd video results. Any help greatly appreciated but the camera settings seem sound.
Manual
Iso 100
shutter 50
fps 24
wb auto
f 5.6
see an example of this type of juddering when panning here

password=inspire

best
chris

Motion, particularly panning, will be much smoother at 30 fps than at 24 fps. Also, don't use too high a shutter speed. 2X the frame rate is a good rule of thumb. The motion blur of a slower shutter speed smooths out the stutter of a higher shutter speed. MPS is a huge factor in artifacts with motion video. I'm not sure what the MPS is for the X5, but if there is a setting, choose the highest MPS available. Lastly, use the 7 second rule for pans; an object moving across the screen should take 7 seconds. This changes with frame rates and shutter speed, but it's a good rule to follow.

Brad

 

[Jonnyb333]

Cheers brad! I learn so much from reading pro stuff like this.

 

[niki]

The stuttering appears mainly not because you shoot at 24 fps but the playback on tv or display that refreshes at 60hz or different than 24. If you play your 24 fps footage on DLP at 24 fps there will be no stuttering like the one you see currently. Of course the time for pan also have to be considered. There is a calculator on the red site for pan speed.
Cinephotography Tools - Panning Speed
With longer lenses a lot more than 7 seconds are recommended. For example with 50mm lens while using half of the sensor size which shuld be close to the x5 sensor size the recommended speed is 50sec for 90° pan. The MPS will do nothing to the stuttering, just minimizes the block artefacts as well gives better color definition.

You should consider where you'll play your production and according to that to shoot with the exact same refresh rate.

 

[crystalfat]

The stuttering appears mainly not because you shoot at 24 fps but the playback on tv or display that refreshes at 60hz or different than 24. If you play your 24 fps footage on DLP at 24 fps there will be no stuttering like the one you see currently. Of course the time for pan also have to be considered. There is a calculator on the red site for pan speed.
Cinephotography Tools - Panning Speed
With longer lenses a lot more than 7 seconds are recommended. For example with 50mm lens while using half of the sensor size which shuld be close to the x5 sensor size the recommended speed is 50sec for 90° pan. The MPS will do nothing to the stuttering, just minimizes the block artefacts as well gives better color definition.

You should consider where you'll play your production and according to that to shoot with the exact same refresh rate.

Yep all taken into consideration. This was just a visual example of the pan stutter i seem to be stuttering now Even on the DLP it's apparent on slow pans with a 180 applied.
I have Dji looking into it and i think there is an issue with the lens.
Thanks for all the comments though some good info there.

 

[crystalfat]

Welcome to the world of cinema. Those pans look about the same as would happen with any cinema film camera, which shoot at 24fps. Slow pans are the order of the day. Faster shutter speeds can make the problem worse. Stick with the old video rule of double the frame rate. Use nd filters if too bright for 1/50 or 1/60 shutter speed. And keep those pans slow if your project needs to be 24fps. If used online, you can up the frame rate and shutter speeds.

My weapons of choice when directing with movie cams are RED or fs700 for super slow (Phantom hire is ridiculous). But with the correct settings depending on the environment and the shot required i can usually pan without issue at 24/25fps with the 180 rule applied and we get the wonderful motion blur that Peter Jackson is trying to destroy

 

[niki]

Yep all taken into consideration. This was just a visual example of the pan stutter i seem to be stuttering now Even on the DLP it's apparent on slow pans with a 180 applied.
I have Dji looking into it and i think there is an issue with the lens.
Thanks for all the comments though some good info there.

If the slow pans have stuttering on DLP then the problem is somewhere else. Maybe try different codec or it's settings. I'm wondering how this can be from the lens? Hope you'll found the problem.
By the way in our company we are also shooting with RED cameras and our DP's doesn't bother to follow those pan speed rules and 99% of the shots are panning visually smooth. But if such a take go for post CG work the guys are having troubles to digitally track the camera because there is invisible for the eye but visible to the tracking algorithms distortion from the faster for the current settings pan.

 

[crystalfat]

If the slow pans have stuttering on DLP then the problem is somewhere else. Maybe try different codec or it's settings. I'm wondering how this can be from the lens? Hope you'll found the problem.
By the way in our company we are also shooting with RED cameras and our DP's doesn't bother to follow those pan speed rules and 99% of the shots are panning visually smooth. But if such a take go for post CG work the guys are having troubles to digitally track the camera because there is invisible for the eye but visible to the tracking algorithms distortion from the faster for the current settings pan.

I was in error. I should have said the camera instead of referring to the glass. Yep like I said it's shot dependant.
Will keep you all updated on the dji findings