Colour grading D-log Footage

[HaydenS]

Hi there,

Just wondering if anyone has experience colour grading D-log footage.

I pretty much always shoot in d-log, however I have been unable to find a method for adding colour in post that I am happy with.

I have been trying to teach myself how to use Resolve, however I use FCP to edit all footage so then I am needing to export XML's then return back to FCP.. in the end it becomes quite complicated.

I have been colour grading in FCP, however Im not really that happy with the results. It certainly doesnt seem as though rough as Resolve. Also I have been using LUT's in FCP with some ok results.

What does everyone else do?

 

[InspiredOne]

Use Premiere Pro CC with Lumetri built in. Makes life so much simpler.

 

[Cactuswest]

HaydenS
Take a look at this site. It is very helpful
Ground Control - Color Grading LUTs for GoPro, Drones, Blackmagic, and More!

 

[gruvpix]

If you are not experienced in resolve, just shoot in cinelike or 'none' mode. You'll get to the end result you want quicker.

 

[Raymondo]

I use Cinema dlog and correct in Premiere Lumetri. Works fine for me. Have not used straight dlog but I don't see why it shouldn't work too. Plenty of adjustment in premiere including curves, saturation, sharpness and LUTs.


Sent from my iPad using InspirePilots

 

[DodgeP]

There is no quick solution to color grading in video because if you have no photography or retouching experience you'll pretty much have to start from step zero. You can use LUT's as a one step solutions or a base template and build from there. FCPX has multiple color grading plugins available and one of them is named, Color Finale. Good Luck!

 

[Dobmatt]

Hi there,

Just wondering if anyone has experience colour grading D-log footage.

I pretty much always shoot in d-log, however I have been unable to find a method for adding colour in post that I am happy with.

I have been trying to teach myself how to use Resolve, however I use FCP to edit all footage so then I am needing to export XML's then return back to FCP.. in the end it becomes quite complicated.

I have been colour grading in FCP, however Im not really that happy with the results. It certainly doesnt seem as though rough as Resolve. Also I have been using LUT's in FCP with some ok results.

What does everyone else do?

The longer I'm looking at the D-log concept (at least in X5 camera case and most recent FW), the more I'm convinced that this format code is either broken here or useless in general. The only advantage I can see is better shadows and highlights articulation, yet identical results I can achieve manipulating this feature in post on footage in Cinema style. Many videographers is reporting the lack of details (sharpness) of D-log footage in comparison to earlier FW versions.

 

[RaptorMan]

The biggest problem I have grading footage from my X5 is a pulsing breathing thing in the shadow detail IF I stretch the contrast too much. If I leave it alone the shadow does not pulsate, but if I go too far with curves or other contrast stretching techniques the shadow detail just kind of flickers. So, I've learned that in order to avoid that I must not use as much contrast adjustment as I'd like from an aesthetic standpoint. Sucks, but DJI is clueless when it comes to image processing and compression.


Brian

 

[Dobmatt]

The biggest problem I have grading footage from my X5 is a pulsing breathing thing in the shadow detail IF I stretch the contrast too much. If I leave it alone the shadow does not pulsate, but if I go too far with curves or other contrast stretching techniques the shadow detail just kind of flickers. So, I've learned that in order to avoid that I must not use as much contrast adjustment as I'd like from an aesthetic standpoint. Sucks, but DJI is clueless when it comes to image processing and compression.


Brian

I'll be really surprised knowing that DJI engineers are involved in digital camera development. Gimbal mechanisms, details of camera housing ... yes, that's their territory. But the guts and software? They aren't that stupid wasting time on a field totally unfamiliar, where giants like Panasonic, Olympus and many others are backed by decades of experience. Anyway, I tend to believe that the real bottleneck for X3 and X5 generation camera is rather mediocre bandwidth, resulting in brutal video compression artifacts. That's why the X5R class was developed for those who demands the best possible. I've started filming adventures when 8mm spring-powered amateur camera was the luxury not many could afford, so ... I'm fine with my Inspire 1 Pro for now ...

Matthew.

 

[RaptorMan]

Yes, well it is entirely possible that DJI has contracted out the development of the X5 camera but whom ever they are using has not done a very good job. Being limited to 60Mbps is a problem and I'd like to see that upped to at least 100Mbps and preferably higher. I would love for the X5 camera to have been designed and built by Panasonic, but DJI is no doubt sticking with a 100% Chinese design so that's out of the question.

I just picked up the new Panasonic G85 M43 4K camera a couple weeks ago and although its far from perfect it is light-years better than the X5 though its bitrate at 100Mbps is not enormously greater than the X5. See link for my first test video on the G85 using default settings. I'll be doing another video on more advanced settings using Cinelike D etc.

Brian

 

[AMGPilot]

I'll be really surprised knowing that DJI engineers are involved in digital camera development. Gimbal mechanisms, details of camera housing ... yes, that's their territory. But the guts and software? They aren't that stupid wasting time on a field totally unfamiliar, where giants like Panasonic, Olympus and many others are backed by decades of experience.

DJI owns Hasselblad so no they are not sticking with 100% Chinese design. They know what they are doing and they are doing it well. Tomorrow you will know more about their future plans.....

 

[AMGPilot]

I'll be really surprised knowing that DJI engineers are involved in digital camera development. Gimbal mechanisms, details of camera housing ... yes, that's their territory. But the guts and software? They aren't that stupid wasting time on a field totally unfamiliar, where giants like Panasonic, Olympus and many others are backed by decades of experience.

See my previous post. You are very incorrect

 

[AMGPilot]

The biggest problem I have grading footage from my X5 is a pulsing breathing thing in the shadow detail IF I stretch the contrast too much. If I leave it alone the shadow does not pulsate, but if I go too far with curves or other contrast stretching techniques the shadow detail just kind of flickers. So, I've learned that in order to avoid that I must not use as much contrast adjustment as I'd like from an aesthetic standpoint. Sucks, but DJI is clueless when it comes to image processing and compression.

The pulsing is a sign of underexposure and no information to extract

 

[Dobmatt]

... DJI purchased Hasselblad ... They know what they're doing ... Tomorrow you will know more about their future plans.....

Assuming the reliability of your sources, you've just confirmed my thoughts ... Tomorrow, you're saying? How? Where? Who are you, AMGPilot? ...

 

[AMGPilot]

Assuming the reliability of your sources, you've just confirmed my thoughts ... Tomorrow, you're saying? How? Where? Who are you, AMGPilot? ...

LOL, the reliability of my sources? Lets just say they are better than any "source" here. yes today. 10:30 am at Warner Brothers studios, I am one of the invited and I'm someone that knows intimately about Motion Picture equipment, So much so I was judging equipment this week for technical awards for one of the Hollywood "Letter" groups

 

[DodgeP]

The longer I'm looking at the D-log concept (at least in X5 camera case and most recent FW), the more I'm convinced that this format code is either broken here or useless in general. The only advantage I can see is better shadows and highlights articulation, yet identical results I can achieve manipulating this feature in post on footage in Cinema style. Many videographers is reporting the lack of details (sharpness) of D-log footage in comparison to earlier FW versions.

This is the entire purpose of DLog, to preserve details in the highlights and shadows with lower contrast and color so that you can grade it later. If you're not into grading footage you shouldn't be using DLog, you should be using one of the other preset solutions. I don't want my footage sharpened in camera either and I doubt other professionals do either, you can't "unsharpen" in camera sharpness with a total bumblefudge of your entire shot.

 

[Dobmatt]

This is the entire purpose of DLog, to preserve details in the highlights and shadows with lower contrast and color so that you can grade it later. If you're not into grading footage you shouldn't be using DLog, you should be using one of the other preset solutions. I don't want my footage sharpened in camera either and I doubt other professionals do either, you can't "unsharpen" in camera sharpness with a total bumblefudge of your entire shot.

That much I know as well. Assuming acceptable level of compression artifacts, the best approach will be to record in D-log mode and with no in-camera sharpening. Unfortunately this is not the case of X5 camera with recent FW, and that's my point. Even with no grading applied and with proper exposure, the video frame exhibits terrible artifacts in shadowy details, smudged contours, pixels color approximation etc. Good enough for many (including myself), but ...

 

[RaptorMan]

The pulsing is a sign of underexposure and no information to extract

No, it isn't underexposed unless one is required to overexpose the highlights in order to bring up the shadow. This pulsing happens even when I do overexpose the highlights IF I try to stretch the contrast more than a little. So, in order to minimize the problem I just don't use as much curves or contrast adjustment as I'd like and that reduces the problem to a manageable level.

My suspicion is that this is due to some combination of crappy image processor and the code used to compress the video. I suspect they don't quiite comprehend what a gamma curve is.

I have several other cameras and don't get this pulsing effect with them in the shadow detail!


Brian

 

[Dobmatt]

Yes, well it is entirely possible that DJI has contracted out the development of the X5 camera but whom ever they are using has not done a very good job. Being limited to 60Mbps is a problem and I'd like to see that upped to at least 100Mbps and preferably higher. I would love for the X5 camera to have been designed and built by Panasonic, but DJI is no doubt sticking with a 100% Chinese design so that's out of the question.

I just picked up the new Panasonic G85 M43 4K camera a couple weeks ago and although its far from perfect it is light-years better than the X5 though its bitrate at 100Mbps is not enormously greater than the X5. See link for my first test video on the G85 using default settings. I'll be doing another video on more advanced settings using Cinelike D etc.

Brian

Brian, even with very basic "mom & dad" settings you can tell G85 is a different league. Wow, what a picture! Why they can't/ couldn't (or don't want to) pull the same from X5 is beyond my understanding ... This summer was my first season with aerial amateur videography, having a few years experience on that field with DSLR's. I was shooting with both Phantom 3 Pro and Inspire 1 Pro and - when comparing the footage - I don't really see much of the difference in terms of image quality. Just recently started experiments with D-log format, but the results with X5 footage are somehow disappointing, to put it politely. I still must confirm that the issues I see in 4K (noisy shadows, smudged contours, lack of sharpness and detail, posterisation) are typical to D-log mode only, or to all modes in general.

Brian, would you do us a favor? When you get nice D-log footage from your new toy, grab a frame or two and download somewhere. Will be nice to know what is possible ...

 

[William Gaddy]

No, it isn't underexposed unless one is required to overexpose the highlights in order to bring up the shadow. This pulsing happens even when I do overexpose the highlights IF I try to stretch the contrast more than a little. So, in order to minimize the problem I just don't use as much curves or contrast adjustment as I'd like and that reduces the problem to a manageable level.

My suspicion is that this is due to some combination of crappy image processor and the code used to compress the video. I suspect they don't quiite comprehend what a gamma curve is.

I have several other cameras and don't get this pulsing effect with them in the shadow detail!


Brian

What you're seeing is dynamic range compression, in concert with the "beating heart" of H264, which is the I-frame refresh every few frames or so. Not sure what the X5 does, but most H264 for broadcast has a cadence of I, P and B-frames that goes something like this every 15 frames: IPBPBPB..PB so if you're seeing the pulsing every half second or so -- it's the H264 codec doing a lousy job trying to cram 4K in to 60 megabit varbiable bit rate.

Cheers