UK Estate Agent Drone Photographer?

[Mactab]

What does one do if you come across an Estate Agent advertising that their photographer is fully licenced and insured for UAV work?
Their web site strangely makes no mention of it though shows lots of aerial images but their Facebook page shows generic pictures of 7-20kg rigs and that their (employed) photographer holds the CAA licence. His name nor the company name doesn't appear on the 4th August 2016 list of approved operators. The photographer also doesn't mention it in his biography on the web site (which to be fair may be out of date)
I've no axe to grind as it isn't the type of work I do but it must be so frustrating for those who have spent so much time and money getting qualified etc.
Does the CAA get involved with this sort of thing or is it a case of 'only when an accident happens?'

 

[Mactab]

errrr 'Port' I was just pointing out that it must be frustrating for those who do this type of work and also asking the Q 'What should one do?'
Effectively he and his company is misrepresenting his business credentials for gain which actually I would have thought is illegal both here and in the US of A.
I did a job recently as a PfAW holder and jumped through hoops to get all the permissions to take off from a park, spoke to the people living nearby , set up a cordon with spotters etc and a guy flying as a hobbyist with no licence was taking off and landing from within and over the crowd and then posted the results on YouTube.
What did I do? Nothing because there isn't anything we can do really. Our CAA seemingly have passed responsibility over to the Police. Who don't know what to do anyway.
Its obviously different in sunny Florida Tell me do you shoot real estate by chance?
Best
Mactab (very much not your neighbour)

 

[DennisR]

What does one do if you come across an Estate Agent advertising that their photographer is fully licenced and insured for UAV work?
Their web site strangely makes no mention of it though shows lots of aerial images but their Facebook page shows generic pictures of 7-20kg rigs and that their (employed) photographer holds the CAA licence. His name nor the company name doesn't appear on the 4th August 2016 list of approved operators. The photographer also doesn't mention it in his biography on the web site (which to be fair may be out of date)
I've no axe to grind as it isn't the type of work I do but it must be so frustrating for those who have spent so much time and money getting qualified etc.
Does the CAA get involved with this sort of thing or is it a case of 'only when an accident happens?'

I can only speak for myself but I would dob him in.

 

[The Editor]

What does one do if you come across an Estate Agent advertising that their photographer is fully licenced and insured for UAV work?
Their web site strangely makes no mention of it though shows lots of aerial images but their Facebook page shows generic pictures of 7-20kg rigs and that their (employed) photographer holds the CAA licence. His name nor the company name doesn't appear on the 4th August 2016 list of approved operators. The photographer also doesn't mention it in his biography on the web site (which to be fair may be out of date)
I've no axe to grind as it isn't the type of work I do but it must be so frustrating for those who have spent so much time and money getting qualified etc.
Does the CAA get involved with this sort of thing or is it a case of 'only when an accident happens?'

Contact the CAA as I have done in almost identical circumstances with a link to the offending site.
I usually get a nice email back thanking me and the 'offending' site usually disappears within 48hrs!
The CAA look very sternly on individuals or companies who purport to hold PFAW but do not.

Report form is Whistleblowing Report Form

Tel :CAA Whistleblowing Focal Point on 01293 573190

 

[PortCanaveralFlorida]

errrr 'Port' I was just pointing out that it must be frustrating for those who do this type of work and also asking the Q 'What should one do?'
Effectively he and his company is misrepresenting his business credentials for gain which actually I would have thought is illegal both here and in the US of A.
I did a job recently as a PfAW holder and jumped through hoops to get all the permissions to take off from a park, spoke to the people living nearby , set up a cordon with spotters etc and a guy flying as a hobbyist with no licence was taking off and landing from within and over the crowd and then posted the results on YouTube.
What did I do? Nothing because there isn't anything we can do really. Our CAA seemingly have passed responsibility over to the Police. Who don't know what to do anyway.
Its obviously different in sunny Florida Tell me do you shoot real estate by chance?
Best
Mactab (very much not your neighbour)

Do I shoot Real Estate? Na, it’s a little boring. Now going on a shoot with HELLFIRE or DAGR, that’s a different story! Better set that Phantom camera to 5000fps+ or you’ll miss it!

 

[Mactab]

Contact the CAA as I have done in almost identical circumstances with a link to the offending site.
I usually get a nice email back thanking me and the 'offending' site usually disappears within 48hrs!
The CAA look very sternly on individuals or companies who purport to hold PFAW but do not.

Report form is Whistleblowing Report Form

Tel :CAA Whistleblowing Focal Point on 01293 573190

Thank you.

 

[DennisR]

Do I shoot Real Estate? Na, it’s a little boring. Now going on a shoot with HELLFIRE or DAGR, that’s a different story! Better set that Phantom camera to 5000fps+ or you’ll miss it!

Im afraid I have no idea what you are trying to say.

 

[Phenomenon]

I’ve seen older and younger people who has nothing else better to do in their lives except point fingers.

“I saw a man at the bar… I know he had a drink…and now he’s driving, that’s illegal!!! I’m calling the cops!

A man is in his living room peeking through the blinds and sees his neighbor has a truck… their are no trucks allowed overnight in the homeowners association (could be borrowed) I’m calling the homeowners association right now!

Mactab…. I’m glad I’m not your neighbor.

I am totally with you on this one. Instead of worrying about what others do, worry about your own work.

 

[DennisR]

I am totally with you on this one. Instead of worrying about what others do, worry about your own work.

I do worry about my own work and living and thats why i will report anyone I can. I enjoy it.

 

[Phenomenon]

I do worry about my own work and living and thats why i will report anyone I can. I enjoy it.

Sorry, didnt realize you work at CAA.

 

[DennisR]

Sorry, didnt realize you work at CAA.

Thats ok. You are forgiven.

 

[lake_flyer]

That's really funny, (ESPRESSO, NOW)
we have this little section on the forum here, to discuss commercial operation related topics, amongst 'brothers in business', because we typically differ in opinion, about our usage, safety, and our 1:1 interpretation and implementation of the law.
I recall negative, even hostile, discussions in the past, between commercial pilots and a few macho hobby trolls, (now very actively trolling on the DJI forum as they have nowhere else left to go, trolling any thread about commercial use and regulations), leading to the founding of the Certified UAV Pilots sub forum. Big thanks to the great moderation on this forum, Editor in particular.

But even here we get confronted with sentiments from apparently 'other types of users', transforming a perfectly legitimate discussion, about a serious problem in our business, into a negative 'them against us' kind of thread.

If any non commercial user has anything meaningful to add to a typical commercial discussion, amongst commercial operators about commercial issues, he's always more than welcome. We know only so much.......
Otherwise we (I'm sure, most of us) are happy to learn from their specific expertise in the appropriate forum sections.

Now on with the topic:
Would I report them? YES.

 

[Mally3]

As a hobbyist I like to fly were its clear open and no crowds but occasionally people seem to materialise from nowhere and your bird is in the air, they start asking questions which in its self is a distraction so I land the bird and switch off then start and answer any questions that I can. However if one of you licensed guys are about and see something that is wrong I would be pleased to be put right, so you all could take the initiative and help educate us lesser mortals in the safe practise of flying. I dont mean this disrespectfully as I and I would think a lot of hobbyist would appreciate the help

 

[lake_flyer]

occasionally people seem to materialise from nowhere and your bird is in the air, they start asking questions which in its self is a distraction so I land the bird and switch off then start and answer any questions that I can

That is a real problem and can occasionally lead to an accident. You're right to land your bird asap. That's why I mark the landing zone and have at least one observer at hand to keep people at a safe distance. Honestly, I don't fly recreationally anymore, too bad. It's a very serious operation now. I wouldn't want to risk my license or my equipment while flying just for fun. As a hobbyist you get fined if you get caught. As a pro, you get jail, a enormous fine, AND you lose your license, just for flying over a big city at night (without special exemptions) for instance. Like shots that are posted on the video/photo section daily. It is logical that Pros are concerned with the incredible ignorant behaviour or some hobbyists, that ultimately leads to even tighter regulations and more rules, making it hard if not impossible for newcomers to thrive in this new business.

I dont mean this disrespectfully as I and I would think a lot of hobbyist would appreciate the help

Appreciated! As I never meant to be disrespectful to any true hobbyist. And as I sincerely meant, some Pros can learn a thing or two from experienced hobby RC flyers or pilots who flew with all 4 or 5 generations of multirotor technology. And there are quite some hobby pilots here who's view we all like to read, even on commercial topics, because they are adding value to any discussion they participate in.

We're all here to learn from each other. Not to point fingers and torpedo discussions.

So your point of view is most appreciated!

 

[The Editor]

As a hobbyist I like to fly were its clear open and no crowds but occasionally people seem to materialise from nowhere and your bird is in the air, they start asking questions which in its self is a distraction so I land the bird and switch off then start and answer any questions that I can. However if one of you licensed guys are about and see something that is wrong I would be pleased to be put right, so you all could take the initiative and help educate us lesser mortals in the safe practise of flying. I dont mean this disrespectfully as I and I would think a lot of hobbyist would appreciate the help

This can be a problem as the Inspire (or UAV's in general) tend to draw attention or interest.

Under current UK regulations for sub 7kg aircraft you are allowed 30m whilst taking off or landing. However, obviously in a situation where someone just strolls up behind you and starts asking questions and chatting strictly speaking you should not bring it into land while they are there.

You can do a couple of things:

• Put the aircraft in a safe hover 50 meters away - answer their questions and hope they move on (but keep a close eye on the aircraft and battery levels)
• Ask the individual(s) if they will comply and stay put while you come into land. If they agree, this puts them under your control and as such you are free to land in front of you.

Once the aircraft is safe on deck and powered down answer all their question.

Providing they are happy to be under your control you can even then give them a demonstration at close quarters - I find what people really find fascinating is watching the FPV feed and seeing what the aircraft is seeing in real time.

 

[lake_flyer]

Put the aircraft in a safe hover 50 meters away - answer their questions and hope they move on (but keep a close eye on the aircraft and battery levels)

You're right. Safe hover zone is the way to handle it. I was wrong to advise to land asap. You should determine your safe hover zone(s) before you take off.

Providing they are happy to be under your control you can even then give them a demonstration at close quarters

I like the close quarters approach too when I feel confident that people are really interested. And able to manage their kids.

 

[lake_flyer]

“I saw a man at the bar… I know he had a drink…and now he’s driving, that’s illegal!!! I’m calling the cops!

It is so ignorant to say things like this.
A very good friend of mine lost his 18year old son while crossing the street because of a drunk driver. That's why there are rules. To protect people from other peoples ignorance. Not to specifically screw you and your hobby.

 

[The Editor]

I like the close quarters approach too when I feel confident that people are really interested. And able to manage their kids.

And dogs!!!!

 

[The Editor]

It is so ignorant to say things like this.
A very good friend of mine lost his 18year old son while crossing the street because of a drunk driver. That's why there are rules. To protect people from other peoples ignorance. Not to specifically screw you and your hobby.

You're right - I've got rid of that post.
I like to try and keep this section a bit tighter moderated than the other areas to keep it professional.

 

[lake_flyer]

And dogs!!!!

So true. They should be kept leashed during a demo, as some of the kids.