Planning precision waypoint flights.

[Joe R]

Ok, I'm going to try one more time to explain my post.
Please keep in mind that many if not most pilots here are very experienced with the Inspire as well as with Autopilot.

Some if not most pilots just starting out (beginners, newbies, take your pick) are already intimidated by the DJI Go App as well as the Inspire itself, In most cases AutoPilot is just too deep for people just starting out.
I imagine that most of you would agree that AutoPilot does have a lot of features and settings to learn. There are far more features and settings with AutoPilot than there are with DJI Go.
If you were just beginning to learn from scratch, would you be able to dive right into Autopilot and....the Inspire......and......be confident and proficient with all of it?

Let me try another scenario (for the certified manned airplane pilots in this group), would you realistically think of starting out with LOW IFR flight and just bypass basic VFR flight? Not to mention bypassing an actual flight instructor. I don't think so but maybe I'm wrong, maybe there are pilots here that jumped right into commercial IFR flying without first obtaining one on one flight training for the basics then work your way up to solo, then to private pilot after being tested by a DFE, then one on one IFR training, then solo IFR cross country flights, then go through the DFE again.

To most beginners with drones that may not have what it takes to be a manned airplane pilot but decide that they want to try their hand at an Inspire with the basic DJI Go App because it's the easiest to learn IMHO. Then work their way up to the AutoPilot App.

I personally don't have the need for Autopilot "For My Needs", the Go App suits my needs just fine. I wouldn't have any problem learning Autopilot and it's not intimidating to me at all, I just don't need it.
I made a three hour IFR flight yesterday, most of the flight was VFR weather but a couple of legs were marginal VFR so I filed an IFR flight plan (both ways).
If I can file and fly an IFR flight, I think I can use an AutoPilot App.
While it seems like most of you make a living solely by being a drone aerial videographer, there are others like myself who only use a drone for 5 to 10% of their filming, at least 90% of my filming business is done on the ground. My drone work is for very short clips close to subjects and obstacles (sometimes I use the obstacles to enhance my close up work, sneaking out from behind an obstacle to reveal the subject has been a very effective filming technique for me and for many other videographers for years).

My helper is just now learning and he has me to teach him the basics (The only things I help him with are the things that he asks about).
I told him about AutoPilot, he checked it out (I assume by watching videos and doing some reading as well) but be stated that he would rather gain more experience with flying his drone and using the Go App first, then work his way into AutoPilot. He may decide that he needs AutoPilot, that's up to him.
I have absolutely "NO" problem with anyone using AutoPilot.
Please remember, most beginners don't really have anyone to teach them (in a one on one manner). Most go out and buy what they need based on information here and through other forums, then at the end of the day, either their heads are spinning or their drone crashed. They don't know what is good information and what isn't. They don't have enough experience to know the difference.
How many arguments take place here in a week's time because one person doesn't agree with another or someone just wants to sound important by giving bad advice that sounds good?

I posted a way for people to make a measurement or two, then do a calculation as a way to improve on their videos. I had no idea that so many would chime in and say to forget the calculations, just use AutoPilot.
I'm sure there is an app for calculating trig as well, I haven't looked but I'm sure there are a few out there.

Imagine "IF" you were a beginner and you run across a way to take a couple of measurements, then do a calculation or two (like this post had) and you think "Great" this will help me out for now (at least until I become more comfortable with all of this stuff that has to be dealt with at one time). Hey maybe it will help for those quick shots even after I become proficient.
But everybody and his brother responds by saying "Don't use that!!!" Use AutoPilot!!
They may feel like they "HAVE" to use AutoPilot to keep from being bashed for using the GO App and using a calculator, then it's more than they can really manage and crash as a result.
Is that fair to beginners?
Maybe I should have included in the title of my post the following: "For Beginners Only" this is "NOT" for experienced pilots!

I still haven't heard anyone prove that they can program AutoPilot and make the flight within fifteen minutes and in one flight.

I can't help but feel that all of the responses about AutoPilot is making beginners feel that they "Have" to use AutoPilot or be made fun of for being too stupid.

Chris, I made a comment about something that I knew for a "FACT" and you came along to tell me (and everyone else) that I was wrong and you knew it because you had heard it from someone else that it was different than what I said, then I proved that I knew what I was talking about. I don't want people to be misinformed by hearsay and guesses. This hobby (or business) is bad enough for some even if they are informed correctly.
Yes, I do have a short fuse for people who go on hearsay and not have reliable data to back it up. When someone follows that (like a beginner) and has an incident due to it, Yeah, I have a problem with that, you would too if you care about other people's property!
And, while we're at it, I later fully admitted that my method was not the thing to do afterall (at least with the Inspire). I made a full post stating that I should not have given my option as a way to do it. It was through more testing that I discovered that it could cause damage by using my method. Furthermore, I fully explained that using my method on drones that have a fully manual mode is fine but not a drone like the Inspire that does not have a fully manual mode. I fully admitted that I was wrong and wasn't afraid to do so.

I read once where one guy said "Do Not" test the vertical play in the motors by pulling up on the motor housing, it will damage the motor. I said "WHAT?" Are you kidding? How do you think the drone is being lifted during flight? Give me a break. That one was pure common sense but they said it anyway.

I don't care what you say about me at all, call it "Bash Joe Day", I don't care and I have thicker skin than you can imagine!!!
What I have a real problem with is letting beginners know by all of these comments that if they use anything but AutoPilot, they're going to be bashed too.
Not to mention, if they come on here and make a suggestion that doesn't mesh with what the masses do, they will torn apart. I've seen it here and on other forums.

Keep in mind, I've never posted anywhere but here and I don't post here very often, I've read a few posts on other forums but most all of my time is spent working on a project somewhere.
I just got back from a 6 hour photoshoot (only 20 minutes of it was with my S1000 with a Black Magic Cinema camera on it). We had to quit because it was an outside shoot and everyone was drained from the heat.
I do come here when I have a moment and when I think I may be able to help someone. This one was a real bust, it was pointless for anyone who read it. If they do decide to use it, they sure can't let anyone here know about it.

This was also meant as a tip for precise waypoint flights that are recorded in flight and flown right afterwards (even for AutoPilot users).
Nobody has bothered to come back to prove that AutoPilot can be programmed, then hit the mark within two feet.
The best GPS day I've seen is 5 meters accuracy, many days they publish the accuracy to be no closer than 30 meters (90 feet). 5 to 30 meters is just fine for manned aircraft but not for close work near obstacles using drones.

I probably just wasted my time trying to put this in perspective but what the ^%$#?
Like I said, I really don't care about what is said about me or to me! I'm very comfortable and confident about what I do and how I do it. It just POs me when a post is bashed causing others to be afraid to post something of their own knowing that they may get bashed as well.

I spent quite a bit of time helping a gentleman here figure out what happened when his Inspire went into the ocean, I was able to determine that the back left prop was not spinning during flight but the others were, I was even able to visually prove it. I enjoyed helping the guy understand what may have happened. How many of us have actually lost sleep wondering what the heck happened after a crash? How many of were worried that we might repeat the same mistake since we didn't know what caused it to begin with?

I've helped others figure out what went wrong during crashes.

Ah, what's the use?

 

[Joe R]

I forgot to mention that the photoshoot I did today was in the woods. I also had to use the S1000 in the woods.
I always keep track of how many satellites there are around 20° of the horizon and how many are closer to straight overhead (even though the ones overhead are less likely to hold the drone very steady). I also keep an eye on the kp levels as well.
Today, there weren't enough satellites overhead to provide a decent fix through the trees at all so I had to "FLY" the whole thing in Atti mode (no GPS).
There's no way AutoPilot could fly it either (without a GPS fix). I was able to set it up (including the settings on the camera) and film the scene in about 20 minutes with a separate camera operator. I used a separate camera operator because the trees were pretty close together with limbs that hung low in places. We filmed through some of the limbs and leaves for an added effect.

Also, for many years all I did for a living was operate a machine shop and design electronic control systems. I've done a lot of part time filming since 1980.
A couple of months ago I was finally given the opportunity to start filming for a broker, mostly specific scenes where I provide the equipment and the crew. They get all of the media, it belongs to them and they protect it well.
This is a big deal for me to get that chance, it's not easy but it's rewarding.
The broker finds scenes around the country, then has people like me (in different areas) film the scene after they give me the shot and audio list. Yes, we do the audio as well, what we do is called the Foley method.
Dialogue audio is usually done by someone else.
The only reason I mentioned this is because some of you know that I am a machinist.

 

[Strgazr27]

"I still haven't heard anyone prove that they can program AutoPilot and make the flight within fifteen minutes and in one flight"

The flight pictured was setup in litchi in less than 10 minutes. Not counting the drive out to the site, and setup time the flight was just over 9 minutes total (the video has been edited to length. It was also the very first video I made and only my second programmed flight). It's not perfect by any stretch but there is NO WAY I could have created this using some math in less time than I did in Litchi. Yes this was flown with a Phantom 3 and this is Litchi but building the mission is the same regardless of AC used.

Video can be seen here.

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Do I think math is becoming a "lost skill"? Absolutely. My wife is the Special Ed coordinator for one of the largest districts here on Long Island, my sister is a principal for another district and my brother in law is a retired math teacher so I have a little experience in the field lol. That being said, for some it is much easier to open an app, draw it out and have at it. You've made your point but so have others and answered your question. Perhaps not in the way you wanted but it was answered.

Have a great day!

 

[Joe R]

"I still haven't heard anyone prove that they can program AutoPilot and make the flight within fifteen minutes and in one flight"

The flight pictured was setup in litchi in less than 10 minutes. Not counting the drive out to the site, and setup time the flight was just over 9 minutes total (the video has been edited to length. It was also the very first video I made and only my second programmed flight). It's not perfect by any stretch but there is NO WAY I could have created this using some math in less time than I did in Litchi. Yes this was flown with a Phantom 3 and this is Litchi but building the mission is the same regardless of AC used.

Video can be seen here.

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Do I think math is becoming a "lost skill"? Absolutely. My wife is the Special Ed coordinator for one of the largest districts here on Long Island, my sister is a principal for another district and my brother in law is a retired math teacher so I have a little experience in the field lol. That being said, for some it is much easier to open an app, draw it out and have at it. You've made your point but so have others and answered your question. Perhaps not in the way you wanted but it was answered.

Have a great day!

First, Very nice filming flight! Very well done! The music was a perfect match as well!

I totally, 100% agree that a flight like that "should" be done with Litchi or AutoPilot. Nice transition from forward turning flight to the POI and nice transition out of the POI back to forward flight. No argument there.

Please, please try to realize that I never suggested using math for a flight like that.
The math was suggested to used to for flights that are very close to an obstacle (that may be directly above your main subject).
The idea is to use math to avoid that obstacle by pre-setting the camera angle, record the first waypoint within a few of feet from your main subject, then climb to a point where the subject is still in the center of the frame, then record waypoint two.
Used it in this way, you are assured to miss the obstacle while flying autonomously from waypoint 1 to waypoint 2 and while flying backwards.
Then the clip is done and done safely.
The math is solely intended for avoiding obstacles while ascending or descending and for short clips using 2 or 3 waypoints max, not planning a flight in an open area. Using math to plan a flight like you did would be next to impossible because it is a horizontal flight with smooth curved turns, math can't account for curved flight or a horizontal plane (no reference point).

When I do a flight similar to what you did, I always fly it with no waypoints or flight plan, I would make a flight like that using FPV but that's just me. I'm certainly not knocking the use of an app like you use!!!

I shouldn't have asked for someone to prove the flight planning time and in one flight. That was too vague. My mistake!!

I did ask if anyone could prove that they can pre plan a flight with AutoPilot or Litchi and put the drone within 8 feet of your subject and have the subject within two feet of the center of the frame while avoiding an obstacle along the way.
That would require that GPS positioning on that day would have to match the flight plan within two feet. Has anyone ever been able to hit your subject "up close" within 8 feet or less and avoid an obstacle at the same time?
Would you fully trust that the flight plan would be accurate enough to miss that object and........put the subject in the center of the frame while your drone is only 8 or 10 feet away from the subject?

Again, very nice video! I think it was well done!! And again, there's nothing wrong with using Litchi to do it. I'm not knocking that in any way!!