Wedding shoot advice please

[John]

In the USA, How do you get around flying within 500 of people? The Section 333 exemptions state: All flight operations must be conducted at least 500' from nonparticipating persons unless protected by barriers or structures, of an FAA waiver. The new Part 107 Rules going into effect this coming week state: No flights directly over a human being unless directly participating in the operation, or under a covered structure unless granted a waiver by the FAA. Attendees to a wedding or event are not directly participating in the UAS operation, right?

 

[IrishSights]

JAG be careful make sure you understand the rules of CAA The PFAW is now PFCO - permission for commercial operations as CAP 393 changed on August 25th See ANO CAP 393 articles 94 and 95.

If you're flying a 0-7 kg MTOM multi rota then:

You can fly over people but no closer than 30 metres if they are not under your control or 7 meters if they are under your control

If the wedding is 1000+ people then you cannot fly over them or within 150 metres

You also need land owners permission for take off and landing.

Get there some time before the first guest and fly all the outside shots. This will enable you to do multi takes at your leisure which will help calm your nerves.

Make sure you have either multiple batteries or multi charger as you will eat the power.

See attached image. We used rope to lay out the shape well before the guests got there. Climb to a good height and make sure it looks ok. Then when the guests get there get them to stand on the rope and face the UAV. then just before the shoot get your spotter or someone to remove the rope.

Visit the venue before the day in question so you can plan and create a shooting plan so you don't forget stuff on the day. Someone else mentioned an OSMO - get one buddy they rock the inside scenes.

Also, most people cannot view 4k very well or even 2.7k - Converting 4k to 1080p is often problematic when mixing frame rates etc. So think hard about your formats

Take stills too as a screenshot of your video is much less quality.

Post your results buddy, have a great day and safe flight mate - good luck mateView attachment 9661

Zap, in the spirit of your own post... be careful you quote CAA 393 correctly. If that's what you are quoting your understanding might need to have a reassessment based on the actual. The people rule in the latest ANO is still 50m not 30m (except takeoff and landing) and no mention of a 7m rule under your control unless your CAA permission is different from mine. I know there can be different CAA permissions but are we not taking about a Standard permission here?

These sort 'facts' are important in a public forum as some take posts as gospel without delving further.

For clarity can you please explain your statements and let us all know if we have missed something. Thanks.

PFAW Holder
BNUC-S Qualified

 

[Zap222]

Sorry thats my own rating with the CAA. CAP 393 (95) simply says in section 4 that the pilots of SUSA (Sub 7kg MTOM) Paragraphs (2)(d) and (3) do not apply to the person in charge of the small unmanned surveillance aircraft or a person under the control of the person in charge of the aircraft.

Clear as mud i know but hope this clears it up for you guys


Small unmanned surveillance aircraft

95.—(1) The person in charge of a small unmanned surveillance aircraft must not fly the aircraft in any of the circumstances described in paragraph (2) except in accordance with a permission issued by the CAA.

(2) The circumstances referred to in paragraph (1) are—

1. (a) over or within 150 metres of any congested area;
2. (b) over or within 150 metres of an organised open-air assembly of more than 1,000 persons;
3. (c) within 50 metres of any vessel, vehicle or structure which is not under the control of the person in charge of the aircraft; or
4. (d) subject to paragraphs (3) and (4), within 50 metres of any person.

(3) Subject to paragraph (4), during take-off or landing, a small unmanned surveillance aircraft must not be flown within 30 metres of any person.

(4) Paragraphs (2)(d) and (3) do not apply to the person in charge of the small unmanned surveillance aircraft or a person under the control of the person in charge of the aircraft.

(5) In this article, “a small unmanned surveillance aircraft” means a small unmanned aircraft which is equipped to undertake any form of surveillance or data acquisition.

 

[The Editor]

Sorry thats my own rating with the CAA. CAP 393 (95) simply says in section 4 that the pilots of SUSA (Sub 7kg MTOM) Paragraphs (2)(d) and (3) do not apply to the person in charge of the small unmanned surveillance aircraft or a person under the control of the person in charge of the aircraft.

Clear as mud i know but hope this clears it up for you guys


Small unmanned surveillance aircraft

95.—(1) The person in charge of a small unmanned surveillance aircraft must not fly the aircraft in any of the circumstances described in paragraph (2) except in accordance with a permission issued by the CAA.

(2) The circumstances referred to in paragraph (1) are—

1. (a) over or within 150 metres of any congested area;
2. (b) over or within 150 metres of an organised open-air assembly of more than 1,000 persons;
3. (c) within 50 metres of any vessel, vehicle or structure which is not under the control of the person in charge of the aircraft; or
4. (d) subject to paragraphs (3) and (4), within 50 metres of any person.

(3) Subject to paragraph (4), during take-off or landing, a small unmanned surveillance aircraft must not be flown within 30 metres of any person.

(4) Paragraphs (2)(d) and (3) do not apply to the person in charge of the small unmanned surveillance aircraft or a person under the control of the person in charge of the aircraft.

(5) In this article, “a small unmanned surveillance aircraft” means a small unmanned aircraft which is equipped to undertake any form of surveillance or data acquisition.

Thanks - as @IrishSights mentions above, I just wanted to be clear on the interpretation of the latest ANO and how it applies to UAV's hence my confusion over the quote of 7 meters.

If the people are under your control and are happy then you can legally land on their head if they are willing and agree to applicable waivers etc!
The salient issues are (as always) for individuals NOT under your control.

 

[Zap222]

Yes mate sorry I should make it clearer hope I haven't mislead anyone or taken away the excitement of the original poster. For persons under your control if your flying sub 7kg you can go closer that 50m and even 30m. The term 'Under your control' is open to interpretation. I have asked the CAA to clarify and they seem to be deliberately vague on this issue but underline that under 7 kg mtom is a completely different thing to SUA which is 7-20 kg mtom.

As most on here fly sub 7 then provided you can argue that people are under your control (flight plan including briefing and spotter) then you can fly to close limits (7 meters in my case)

Very good luck JAG post your results would love to see how you get on

 

[Zap222]

In the USA, How do you get around flying within 500 of people? The Section 333 exemptions state: All flight operations must be conducted at least 500' from nonparticipating persons unless protected by barriers or structures, of an FAA waiver. The new Part 107 Rules going into effect this coming week state: No flights directly over a human being unless directly participating in the operation, or under a covered structure unless granted a waiver by the FAA. Attendees to a wedding or event are not directly participating in the UAS operation, right?

500 foot John that sucks man

 

[Zap222]

Zap, in the spirit of your own post... be careful you quote CAA 393 correctly. If that's what you are quoting your understanding might need to have a reassessment based on the actual. The people rule in the latest ANO is still 50m not 30m (except takeoff and landing) and no mention of a 7m rule under your control unless your CAA permission is different from mine. I know there can be different CAA permissions but are we not taking about a Standard permission here?

These sort 'facts' are important in a public forum as some take posts as gospel without delving further.

For clarity can you please explain your statements and let us all know if we have missed something. Thanks.

PFAW Holder
BNUC-S Qualified

Hi mate see my last post with includes 393 section 95 (the old 167) all changed mate see section 4. Also PFAW is now PFCO permission for commercial operation - no mention of areal work anymore, they removed it.

 

[Zap222]

This link might help

https://publicapps.caa.co.uk/docs/33/InformationNotice2016073.pdf

 

[John]

Sorry thats my own rating with the CAA. CAP 393 (95) simply says in section 4 that the pilots of SUSA (Sub 7kg MTOM) Paragraphs (2)(d) and (3) do not apply to the person in charge of the small unmanned surveillance aircraft or a person under the control of the person in charge of the aircraft.

Clear as mud i know but hope this clears it up for you guys


Small unmanned surveillance aircraft

95.—(1) The person in charge of a small unmanned surveillance aircraft must not fly the aircraft in any of the circumstances described in paragraph (2) except in accordance with a permission issued by the CAA.

(2) The circumstances referred to in paragraph (1) are—

1. (a) over or within 150 metres of any congested area;
2. (b) over or within 150 metres of an organised open-air assembly of more than 1,000 persons;
3. (c) within 50 metres of any vessel, vehicle or structure which is not under the control of the person in charge of the aircraft; or
4. (d) subject to paragraphs (3) and (4), within 50 metres of any person.

(3) Subject to paragraph (4), during take-off or landing, a small unmanned surveillance aircraft must not be flown within 30 metres of any person.

(4) Paragraphs (2)(d) and (3) do not apply to the person in charge of the small unmanned surveillance aircraft or a person under the control of the person in charge of the aircraft.

(5) In this article, “a small unmanned surveillance aircraft” means a small unmanned aircraft which is equipped to undertake any form of surveillance or data acquisition.

Do you have a definition or specification for "congested area?" (We have similar in the US, but have not been able to find an FAA definition for it.)

 

[The Editor]

Do you have a definition or specification for "congested area?" (We have similar in the US, but have not been able to find an FAA definition for it.)

Congested area (as per CAA definition):This is defined in relation to a city, town or settlement: any area which is substantially used for residential, commercial, industrial or recreational purposes.

 

[JAG1]

WOW! thank you for all the great advice. the bride and groom have made it very clear that a drone will be in use on the day, and they all seem very excited about it(wish i was!!).
i have worked out the heart shape by making a circle then pulling the bottom down and then the top, seems to work well. i have also been and visited the venue, spoke to the land owner and all is good....apart from the bloody trees! Flight plan done, roll on tomorrow...

thanks again

 

[Zap222]

Have a great day buddy

 

[JAG1]

well that was a stressful day! but i think i got the photo's they wanted.. i did miss a couple of shots because the photographer took over and left me very little time! when it came to heart photo, i had about 60 seconds to get it done! 30 seconds in i notice people getting bored and were about to move!! i also used my Osmo to get footage, one of the best bits of footage i got was when i told the bride and groom to hold the osmo with it facing them, they loved looking into the monitor recording them selfs, which then got the guests involved!
what have i learnt..
need more batteries and another osmo so my wife can go off and get footage

here is one of the photos from today..

cheers

 

[Zap222]

Oh man they are going to love it. Great job mate

 

[JAG1]

cheers mate, like i said...very stressful day BUT I'm glad i did it