But all the commercial businesses want is final rules so they can execute business plans and secure funding from investors. I think the pressure they have been getting on the hill is from the AMA about the special rule for model aircraft that is part of the reauthorization, and the FAA is getting pressure from the hill to finalize Part 107. I wouldn't bet money one way or the other, but I do hope the final rule comes out this year. I'll be truly surprised if they hit the June target that everyone talks about.
Pilot's license requirement might not be so silly afterall
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Congress could care less about the hobbyists, they don't have the $$$ big corporations will bring to the table. Boeing, Northrop-Grumman and a ton of smaller companies need to get in the game asap and requiring pilots licenses is just one more obstacle they'd rather not have. How much do you think the AMA contributes to politicians versus big aerospace and new UAS companies? When it comes to Congress it's all about money.
I agree with you, June is a pipe dream.
I agree with you, June is a pipe dream.
Yeah, I see no way 100% of commercial drone use should require a full on pilots license. I can see how current pilots might wish that a pilots license be required but the use and consequences are quantitatively different things. About the lightest private plane you can find is on the order to 10X the weight of the 55 pound UAV limit and the average is probably closer to 25X with speeds 2X-5X -- the energy levels are several orders of magnitude different.
As I mentioned in my prior I expect a 2 tiered system of certification and training to cover all but the most extreme drones and drone use. I can see a third category for fully autonomous drone use as in the Amazon delivery ideas and there may well be several sub categories for that based on size and payload.
Brian
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I've held a commercial pilot certificate since 1976 and I don't care if the new rule does away with pilots licenses (they should). My business base is already in place and I do not fear any competition, can't beat experience. My customers are very impressed with the fact I do have a comml' pilot certificate. It is a business advantage in a dog-eat-dog world. Some kid with a Phantom and a newly minted FAA UAS certificate is not going to get my business. Commercial UAS operators do not require the pilot skills I had to acquire. The UAV flight task only requires a basic aviation ground school (airspace rules, weather, reading a sectional chart, and FARs) in order to fly safely. From day one I advocated that requiring pilot licenses is stupid; the FAA got caught with their pants down by the UAV explosion( hell, they didn't even had a UAS Integration Office until 2013) and resorted to their comfort zone (FAA is an organization for pilots, ran by pilots).
Were I king of the world or at least FAA director
I would have made completion of a private pilot ground school and passing the private pilot written exam the only requirement to becoming a commercial UAS pilot. That would have ended this quagmire and we would be far down the regulatory road. Requiring physical pilot skills to fly UAVs is beyond stupid.
Were I king of the world or at least FAA director
I would have made completion of a private pilot ground school and passing the private pilot written exam the only requirement to becoming a commercial UAS pilot. That would have ended this quagmire and we would be far down the regulatory road. Requiring physical pilot skills to fly UAVs is beyond stupid.
Now that's sound fair to me!I've held a commercial pilot certificate since 1976 and I don't care if the new rule does away with pilots licenses (they should). My business base is already in place and I do not fear any competition, can't beat experience. My customers are very impressed with the fact I do have a comml' pilot certificate. It is a business advantage in a dog-eat-dog world. Some kid with a Phantom and a newly minted FAA UAS certificate is not going to get my business. Commercial UAS operators do not require the pilot skills I had to acquire. The UAV flight task only requires a basic aviation ground school (airspace rules, weather, reading a sectional chart, and FARs) in order to fly safely. From day one I advocated that requiring pilot licenses is stupid; the FAA got caught with their pants down by the UAV explosion( hell, they didn't even had a UAS Integration Office until 2013) and resorted to their comfort zone (FAA is an organization for pilots, ran by pilots).
Were I king of the world or at least FAA director
I understand folks want to monopolize the business but if your skilled that skill should speak for itself.
You got my vote faa director sorry if I had to agree with you
I've held a commercial pilot certificate since 1976 and I don't care if the new rule does away with pilots licenses (they should). My business base is already in place and I do not fear any competition, can't beat experience. My customers are very impressed with the fact I do have a comml' pilot certificate. It is a business advantage in a dog-eat-dog world. Some kid with a Phantom and a newly minted FAA UAS certificate is not going to get my business. Commercial UAS operators do not require the pilot skills I had to acquire. The UAV flight task only requires a basic aviation ground school (airspace rules, weather, reading a sectional chart, and FARs) in order to fly safely. From day one I advocated that requiring pilot licenses is stupid; the FAA got caught with their pants down by the UAV explosion( hell, they didn't even had a UAS Integration Office until 2013) and resorted to their comfort zone (FAA is an organization for pilots, ran by pilots).
Were I king of the world or at least FAA director
I can buy that with the proviso that what you describe with ground school would be the higher level 2 that I mentioned with a lesser rating that's a bit less rigorous and time consuming but with more limitations on use. If you want to fly a 55 pound drone in proximity to groups of people that's going to require the higher rating, but flying a 4 pound drone to video/photo a piece of land should not require that level of certification though there would be a good deal of overlap.
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Well, currently private pilot ground school is ground school, not sure how much the bird's weight can make a difference during the safety phase of the training. Private pilot ground school is generic and not based on whether the aircraft is a Cessna 150 or a Piper Cherokee 6 (much heavier than the Cessna) Would a person struck on the head by a 45 lb. drone be less dead than a 55 lb one?
But I am all for good safety practices and leave it to the FFA to come up with sensible rules.
I hope that those of us with a Pilots license and a log book that documents UAV experience will be able to bypass the proposed UAV operators license some how.
No doubt your arguments about the differing physical characteristics are valid - but you also can't buzz someone's head or face with a Cessna. I'm a licensed pilot, and my only hope is that they don't make it too easy for someone to operate a drone commercially. I'd have no problem with the language in the proposed Part 107 so long as the ground school and exam are the real deal and not some online crap where a person could pass the test without being conversant in NAS rules and regs. I have to worry that my pilot's license wouldn't exempt me from the new sUAS certificate written test if they go that route and make it final before my 333 comes through. I haven't seen any language about an exemption or grandfather clause for licensed pilots. I do know that it would be a subset of the comprehensive written I had to pass for my PPL - but bureaucracy being what it is, logic and fairness may not prevail. For the time, effort and expense of getting my PPL, and staying current, I'd be pretty hot to have to repeat aeronautical knowledge training.
I totally agree with everyone who has said that being a pilot doesn't mean you know how to control a sUAS, and I'm surprised that there is no practical test in the proposed rule.
I want whatever licensing system can be put in place to ensure that someone who has the miraculous ability to crash not one, but four phantoms, is not flying anywhere near me.
I could be wrong because I don't read much about defense contractors, but I would think their lobbying is more related to trying to sell their products (drones or otherwise) for hundreds of millions of dollars. Even if they are somehow in the sUAS game, I don't think they would be worried about a pilot's license requirement - they hire military pilots.
I'm a licensed pilot and have been flying a quadcopter for over 2 years, and I wouldn't think I'd be qualified to fly anything for Northrop or Boeing, no matter how much it might weigh. I couldn't hold a candle to a military pilot.
That was my thought too but then he explained it was in his own safe space, not in public.
I didn't start out with a Hubsan x4. I started with the vision plus.
Had some crashes figured out what was the cause removed the prop guards been saving money since. Graduated to the i1,15 months in one forced landing otherwise smooth flying.
SeanMc you just here for the drama
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True, but you are thinking about Predators and Raptors. Take a good look around, there are numerous universities and test sites plus new companies flying and developing sUASs for a number of applications (agricultural, public safety, etc.) far from the million dollar range and having to hire licensed pilots is a burden on the bottom line.
Yes, I mentioned before the a pilot isn't permitted to buzz the heads in a Cessna and the point was that there are certain minimum height requirements. I Cessna pilot can fly over a high school football stadium filled with people if he's high enough but can't when he's lower. A small UAV flown by a suitably certified pilot should be able to fly lower over a crowd but not buzz there heads.
The thing that's going to throw a monkey wrench into the works is Amazon and others wanting to fly totally autonomous and the fact that there will be many practical uses for fully autonomous flight that go well beyond delivering packages. I see a range of autonomous drones for SAR and the only way to make them practical is to permit them to fly beyond eyesight of the pilot and to fly fully autonomously. If such a range of drones were available last June it's likely the two escaped convicts in upstate NY would have been captured within a couple days. Being able to send out a dozen SAR drones at night using FLIR and 4K video would make finding and saving lost people before they die much more likely as well.
The USAF trains drone pilots and has found that it's easier to train newbies than to convert trained pilots -- FACT!
Brian
Any one have notion of when they will finalize the 107 requirements? Frustrating waiting to hear what kind of training an aspiring commercial UAV pilot will need.
Not to be flip, but after polling as many sources as I could find, the answer is anywhere from this June to another year or more. Also, whenever the final rule is announced, it doesn't go into effect immediately, but at least at that point everyone would know what's coming.
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My 2 cents while you wait? Find and complete a good private pilot ground school. There are some online courses. My guess is that a major chunk of the written exam will be on national airspace rules, navigation, weather, FARs (Federal Aviation Regulations), etc, the stuff you will find in a ground school. Reviewing the Pilot's Handbook of Aeronautical Knowledge, free here is a good way to spend your time between now and the exam. Don't concern yourself with a flight check, the FAA knows the UAVs are easy to fly; plus they don't have enough examiners to go out and test every applicant (seriously doubt Congress is going to give them some juicy big budget for this). Some countries like the UK are testing applicants for flight skills, but keep in mind they are very small populations (in comparison with the US).
IF A DRONE brings down an aircraft full of people between now and then, disregard everything above. The overreaction to kill the drone industry will crush us all...
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